Listen to Rosie Mankes as she shares what she learned to ease the transitioning of her mother into an assisted living facility.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08DJ9ZWND
https://www.kathysconsulting.com/
https://knowledge-for-caregivers.simplecast.com/episodes/early-signs-of-dementia
KATHY COCKS: Hi, I am Cathy and the host of this podcast. I have been a geriatric nurse and helping seniors and their families for the past 10 years. I am passionate to educate all those who are on this caregiving journey with me. I want to welcome you back. And today I am interviewing Rosie Mankes. She's the author of a book called find your joy and run with it. She writes about her battle with breast cancer transitioning her mom into a facility and the unexpected loss of her brother. Recovery from these major challenges inspired her to become a life coach in order to help people pull through significant adversity in life challenges. The reason I wanted to interview Rosie was that she had written an article about what she wished she had known when she was transitioning her brother into a memory care. And Rosie, when I read your article, the first thing you talked about was don't be in denial. I was curious, what are some of the early symptoms that you kind of saw in your mother that you were starting to think maybe something else is going on here?
ROSIE MANKES: Well, first, let me say thank you for having me on your show. And also to that point. So my mom started probably about five or six years ago starting to repeat herself. And it progressed, then, you know, I think that we kind of thought her mom had it. And now she had it. That's really signs of dementia, we started to think we needed to take a deeper look into what was really going on in the house. She was living independently in Brooklyn, New York, and I live in New Jersey, and two of my siblings were living out a state. So we would go over to her house. And then you know, check her clothing, which was a clothing stain. She's wondering her clothes that she had any sort of body odors that she not showering. And we learned, as we were just learning this along the way that people with dementia do not like to go into the shower. So she would maybe go in but not really using the soap. We also learned that she wasn't cooking for herself anymore. She was eating cookies for dinner. Or if there was food rotting in the refrigerator because she wasn't able to put together time and how long something would stay along the way as we're going on this journey. We also said, Wait, she's forgetful, what if she forgets how to get home and she's driving so or where she could hurt herself or somebody else right?
I took her for an assessment with a neurologist and he gave her cognitive tests and she failed. And we took the license away. It was really, really rough for her. She was very, very upset about that. But it was done for the right reasons. I guess a really significant one was her being in charge of a meds. What we learned is that she wasn't charged for events for a long time. But there came a point where she wasn't able to manage it anymore. And a real tipping point for us when we knew okay, this is life threatening was we came to visit her and she was face planted on her kitchen table. Because she had put two Lunestas and an oxycodone in in one of the vials. We said this is life threatening. And we need more help originally started with help being somebody that came in a couple of days a week when she was a little bit better than what I just described. Then she had a full time 24/7 companion living with her and I made an arrangement with a companion could drive her to my house because the woman that had a husband and a child every other weekend, so she could go home and spend the weekend or extended weekend with her family, I would fill in for the companion, we just started to see that there were very little signs at the beginning of decline. But it wasn't going to get better, it started to get worse. And that's where we made the transition from living at home into a facility because her needs were up here. And our ability to care for them. Were down here based on my also having breast cancer and double mastectomy. And that's when we transition into assisted living.
KATHY COCKS: I think a lot of people do have those early signs and they can sort of live alone but you guys did from what I see in my industry the right thing you're like keeping tabs of okay, when is that point then you and a lot of people do start with that bringing people in the home. That's what I do is help people stay home. But it does get to the point where you're trying to manage this long distance and you just can't do it anymore. On the driving. Did you just that day say that's it. You took away the keys. How did that happen? I know that's a question that sometimes gets asked.
ROSIE MANKES: It's a it was a heartbreaking thing because my mom really loves her independence and ability to drive. She didn't drive. Earlier on in her life. She got her license a little later. We just basically I took it to the neurologist, I knew what my plan was. And I told him in confidence. And when he did the cognitive test, she couldn't pass. We said that he took her license away from it because if I said I took it she was going to fight with me and want it back but it really was a very tough one. She pushed back tremendously as you might imagine anyone doesn't want to lose their independence and their ability to drive. But I think what helped her little bit was at that point, we also got the companion. So she had somebody to take her from doctor's appointment or to the grocery store. So that kind of filled in a little bit on that and didn't make it as harsh.
KATHY COCKS: That's a great point of not just taking the keys, but then you found a solution of okay, I know, we're not gonna let you drive, but we're going to have somebody take you places. And I know, it's still hard. I just think that driving in America is the hardest thing because people are so used to having that independence and driving their whole life. I can imagine that that was hard. The second thing you talked about is don't feel guilty. Tell me a little bit about that point that you made in the article.
ROSIE MANKES: So I come from 100% Italian. So I come from a very strong Italian family values, you take care of your people, you don't put them into a facility, you know, they stay with you. That was the kind of thing that I always brought up to believe. When we got to the point where my mom, in addition to dementia, she also had some underlying health issues. So she had been hospitalized at one point for a bleed in her stomach and her hemoglobin levels went to a point where the doctor didn't even know why she was still alive. And she was at home. I went to her house in Brooklyn and drove her to the nearest hospital so we could save her. And also she had some digestive issues so she would get soiled herself. So now understanding that I'm going through multiple biopsies on lumpectomies bilateral mastectomy reconstructive surgery. So her care level is here, my ability up here, you know, freezing my hands and sky. And my ability to meet those needs is is down here based on my own health issues we needed to make that transition work. I would say that biggest tipping point of this whole thing is that I learned along the way that it's not something that you want to push on the person you love one, I've heard people say,
Well, you know where you're going to move into this place in that that, we introduced it to my mom as a trial. We said we'll do a two week trial, and we'll see how it goes. And you know, she was very fearful and resistant. Another thing I learned along the way was that you're supposed to bring as many of your loved ones items from their home to where they'll be moving into with that we put her bedroom sat in the room that she was moving into her beloved curio cabinet with her yard throws some pictures and stuff like that. The other thing I learned is that it was really important for me to try to make her an advocate for me like she was going to be helping me, I didn't share it with my mom because she had dementia. And I didn't want to worry her more than she needs to be worried. So I didn't share about what I was going through with breast cancer. But I said to her, I'm going through some stuff, it'd be really helpful if you live closer to me, and that we could see each other more often too.
And I share another thing is that I like to go back lots of times during the week, so that you would understand that now you're closer I could come by just to bring you a cup of coffee, you know, I could come by just to give you a hug. And I think that's really important.
And then I'll talk a little bit about self care in that respect is that my mom would say to me, I want to go home, I want to go home, I don't want to be here I want to be here. And it got to the point where it was so emotional for me that I had to learn to use deflection. So like we did with our children, when my children were younger, I'd say we can't do it today will Can we talk about it tomorrow or even in the sense of self care was if it was too much emotionally on me having her say those things, I would say I just got an email from work and I need to take it I need to go back to work because it was too emotional for me. That being said, circling back to self care, I needed to learn self care, I didn't know self care before that as a result, I started to create these like, must use these meet I must do is that I do and then I also feel non negotiables that allow me to as the person that's has the person going through this transition, you still need to take care of yourself. So for me the meeting muscles was exercising three times a week, practicing gratitude. I wear a bracelet it's called the blessings bracelet. It has four beads on it. And every day I acknowledged for blessings in my life.
Also meditation on a daily basis. And when somebody told me meditation, I said oh my god, I you know, there's never going to happen for me I have a marching band going on in my head. But actually I stuck with it. I just last month, celebrated 14,000 minutes meditating with headspace. Self Care also is acts of kindness. And when you do acts of kindness to others, they so appreciate it but but also you get back tenfold, but not only acts of kindness to others, but to yourself. So every day I write down today I will be kind to myself by doing blank. And then I fill in blank and it could be yoga, a bubble bath, sitting in the sun, reading a book, whatever that might be. So I take that time for myself and I started doing this when there was really, really over whelmed with the stuff that was going on in my life and particularly the transition of my mom as a way of healing and being able to take care of myself.
KATHY COCKS: You brought up great points I love your idea of because I have aging parents, we have one still at home because he's married, so my mother in law can take care of him. But the idea of that trial think that such a great idea, if people are saying they're resisting is presenting that as a trial and the deflection, we call it in our industry redirection to go talk about something else. So those are really great ideas. I've been talking a lot, so much about self care, because if you don't do it, you're just not going to make it for the long term dementia, as you know, is five years to 20 years. Your third point was talking about you don't have to go this alone. So what made you and you talked about therapy, which I will say as I read your story, even though I haven't had to transition a parent or gone through cancer, it's been a rough five years with launching adult children, my husband's had health problems. My aging parents myself, I did the same thing. I was like, I had to go see a counselor. My anxiety was just so high. What made you kind of do that? And how did that help you?
ROSIE MANKES: That one year it's September of 2015, to September of 2016, I experienced three major losses. I lost my mom, not physically, but mentally with the whole dementia decline. I was my breast via breast cancer, and my brother died in a very horrific, tragic accident. So at the third time, what the third thing happened when my brother passed away, I just said, I can't do this alone. And I went to see a therapist and she was very helpful in terms of helping me to process all the the grief and the loss, but also my own experience as a life coach, because I became a life coach shortly after my double mastectomy, helped me to pull the things I need to do to pull together in order to work towards moving from adversity to wholeness and healing. I share that when I speak or through my life coaching sessions with my clients, the things that I did, that helped me to move from that dark despair and path to one of more joyful and finding joy in everyday living.
KATHY COCKS: Thankfully, I think nowadays, talking about going to therapy is so much more accepted than it was before. But I talk about it. Like I said, when I was going through that at work, I was like, okay, every Tuesday at three o'clock, I'm sorry, I'm out of here, because it's that self care. I said, I am going to be a better worker for you if I actually go and get help getting through this timeframe, because it was definitely a struggle for me during that time also, and then you talk about it gets easier or better. Have you found that true with especially with your mom being in you, I know you moved from assisted living to memory care, have you found it easier to adjust to that now,
ROSIE MANKES: I will say that it better it takes time. It depends on what kind of pushback your loved one is giving. In my case, my mother, they said in their combined years of experience between the social worker the the director and the nurse have like 90 years combined experience. She was the most resistant person that they've ever experienced. I can say I always had a hard time telling the story up until recently. But I remember about seven months into my mom's living in assisted living. She looked at me and she said, you see that lady over there. And she said she's never happy. She said, I like it here we have a three room apartment. And I did give us nice food. And we have social our and I just looked away and started crying. She finally came around and it was like, wow, this is so great. And I really feel I did a lot of research on where my mom would live. And as you well know, being in the industry, you go into some places. And the first thing is smells urine, or you know, this slumped over and not engaging. I did a lot of research on the place that my mom is in now. And I could put my head on my pillow at night and feel we made the right choice we really did. You can tell you can tell when you go in? Is a staff authoritative or they compassionate? How long? Does it take them to answer a request? Or if somebody brings their pendant? How long does it take to them to go and you know, and respond to them. There's so many different things that you I looked for. And when I was looking into this place, so many of them that I walked in and then walked right out because I was just so so very disappointed. I found the place that I can feel very, very proud that my mom's in.
KATHY COCKS: when you were looking for facilities at the time. You told us a little bit of your thought process you you're looking at smell and compassion. Did you have anybody help you? Or did you sort of just do your own research and just scheduled a lot of visits? Did you break that up with your other family members?
ROSIE MANKES: So my both of my siblings lived out of town I live in I live closest to my mom at the time when she was living in Brooklyn. I'm in New Jersey some state next to it. One of my siblings was living in Las Vegas at the time. My brother was living in South Carolina so I did all the visits. I live in Monmouth County, New Jersey. So I went to all the ones that people suggested I go to and then I went to Among others, I think my mistake was that if when I walked in, I knew right in that moment, it didn't feel right, I should have never gone back, I went back because I thought maybe it'll be better than next time. But it just never was, I find that what helped me was when I narrowed it down to the ones that I liked, I visited popped in at different times of the day, because a breakfast time is going to be different than a social hour, which is going to be different than an exercise time. And to see you know, what was going on at different times during the day. So that was something that I did in my in my narrowing it down to find the right place.
KATHY COCKS: That is really good. Because I've always tell people go always go at least during meal time, because that's when you really see all the resident, but I don't work a whole lot in facilities. It's just the little bit that I've seen. But I really like those different suggestions of if you know, you don't like a place that wastes your time there anymore. That right, definitely. And then once you like, pop in at different times, and you had that caregiver with your mother, so you had a little bit of time correct to look for a place
ROSIE MANKES: I did, I had a little bit of time to really look for a place and find what I thought would be the right place for my mom.
KATHY COCKS: Right and being in the right place that you feel that I'm sure that gives you that peace. Like I know at first it was hard emotionally but she still felt like she was being taken care of.
ROSIE MANKES: I felt like last year when we did the transition, we talked about you know, my mom transition from assisted to living to memory care. I was I pushed back pretty hard on that because I didn't want her to leave assisted because assisted felt like she had all these activities and all these things and to do and friends and social hours and stuff. But the the thing that was really eye opening that happened to us was, you know, we're in the middle of July of 2020. So we're in the middle of the pandemic and one of the staff came to set my mom up with Zoom call with my sister, the person left to attend to other people. And she came back into the room and she was like, Oh my God, my mom was sitting at her kitchen table and she was eating carried coffee grinds. And then it was just right there timeout. You know what she needs more supervision, she needs a simpler existence. And I cried, I told the director of the memory care I said she was she was so so compassionate, and also soothing to me. And I said, You're the only good thing that feels like it's coming out of this thing, because I really don't didn't want her to go into memory care. But I'm going to trust you on this one. And guess what, you know what she's in a simpler environment. She's keeping up she doesn't have the stress that she had on her face that we didn't even realize that she looked always stressed out, she looks so much calmer and her needs are being met more, you know more personally than when she was an assistant, she really didn't need to make that that transition.
KATHY COCKS: Well, thank you for sharing that. And that's what I also try to tell people, you make a decision. It doesn't have to be permanent, or you can change it's not easy to change. But you can change once you realize this isn't what's working anymore. Now we have to do something different. So sometimes I think people get they get really fixed like, okay, we're stuck here. So I think, you know, you shared a tremendous amount of wisdom of what you did with your mom, tell us a little bit again about your book, promote that. And we'll close it out after that.
ROSIE MANKES: As I shared, you know, I had this very difficult year. And the book is about that transition, like going from that place of despondency and despair to emotional wellness and the things that I did to in order to bring myself there. And people that come to me at book signings or email me will say that they took the things that I did in that book, and they've applied it to their own lives, and they implemented into their lives. And that was like a really, like, amazing thing because I wrote it thinking it was just cathartic for me to write this story. But the fact that people are saying that, actually just today somebody sent me a note messenger saying, you know, I bought your your book for my wife, and she feels like you're speaking directly to her like she knows you. And I was like, Wow, that's great. I love that. So I mean, if you're looking for to read something about how you can make that transition from that place, a place where you're struggling, whether it be with you know, we talk specifically about my journey with my mother and my journey with my cancer and was my brother, and moving to a place where you can find joy in everyday living. My book is full for the name light. The title of my book is find your joy and run with it and it's available on Amazon. Or you could go to my website, which is my name WWW.rosiemankes.net, to learn more about my life coaching services, and also the book.
KATHY COCKS: But thank you very much, Rosie. I really have enjoyed it. I've learned something. Because even though I'm in the industry, I haven't been through that process of moving a parent or a loved one into a facility. I've kind of seen that sometimes when it's the first hand account. It definitely I think gives my listener some great insights. And I really appreciate you being on here. Everything that you have said the book, the title, the website will be in the show notes if people want to follow up with that. So I really appreciate you being on.
ROSIE MANKES: Well, thank you. Thank you for having me. I enjoyed our time discussing
KATHY COCKS: if you have found this information helpful, feel free to share it with someone else. If you wish to contact me you can at info at www.kathyconsulting.com. I welcome any comments. Remember, this podcast is meant for informational purposes only, and not replace the advice of your medical professionals.